Comparison of Divisions: Gurkha Settlement Rights — Government defeat — 29 Apr 2009 at 15:49 with Division No. 135 on 19 May 2009 at 17:19

(Swap the two divisions around).

Vote (a) : Gurkha Settlement Rights — Government defeat - 29 Apr 2009 at 15:49 - Division No. 104

The majority of MPs voted in favour of the motion:[1]

  • This House
  • regrets the Government's recent statement[2] outlining the eligibility criteria for Gurkhas to reside in the United Kingdom;
  • recognises the contribution the Gurkhas have made to the safety and freedom of the United Kingdom for the past 200 years;
  • notes that more Gurkhas have laid down their lives for the United Kingdom than are estimated to want to live here;
  • believes that Gurkhas who retired before 1997 should be treated fairly and in the same way as those who have retired since;
  • is concerned that the Government's new guidelines will permit only a small minority of Gurkhas and their families to settle whilst preventing the vast majority;
  • further believes that people who are prepared to fight and die for the United Kingdom should be entitled to live in the country; and
  • calls upon the Government to withdraw its new guidelines immediately and bring forward revised proposals that extend an equal right of residence to all Gurkhas.

As a consequence, the alternative Government motion, which read:[3]

  • This House
  • recognises that this Government is the only one since the Second World War to allow Gurkhas and their families settlement rights to the United Kingdom;
  • notes that in 2004 the Government permitted settlement rights to Gurkhas discharged since 1997, following the transfer of the Brigade HQ from Hong Kong to the United Kingdom;
  • further notes that under these rules around 6,000 Gurkhas and family members have been welcomed to the UK;
  • acknowledges that the court judgement of September 2008 determined that the 1997 cut-off date was fair and rational, while seeking clarification of the criteria for settlement rights for those who retired before 1997;
  • further notes that on 24 April the Government published new and more generous guidelines for the settlement applications of Gurkhas who retired before 1997;
  • supports this revised guidance, which will make around 10,000 Gurkhas and family members eligible to settle in the UK;
  • further notes that the Government undertakes actively to inform those who may be eligible in Nepal of these changes and to review the impact of the new guidance within 12 months;
  • further notes that the contribution Gurkhas have made is already recognised by pensions paid to around 25,000 Gurkhas or their widows in Nepal that allow for a good standard of living there; and
  • further notes that in the year 2000 Gurkha pensions were doubled and that, earlier in April 2009, in addition to an inflationary uplift of 14 per cent., those over 80 years old received a 20 per cent. increase in their pension.

... was never voted upon.

Although this extremely rare Government defeat in an opposition day motion is not binding (has no legal force)[4] a Government minister made a statement later in the day to bring "forward the date for the determination of the outstanding applications to the end of May."[5]

Vote (b) (unedited): Commission for the Compact — New Clause 32 — Retention of samples following arrest - 19 May 2009 at 17:19 - Division No. 135

'(1) The Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (c.60) is amended as follows.

(2) After section 64A insert-

"64B Retention of samples

(1) Subject to subsection (2), where a sample has been taken from a person under this Part, unless such a person has been given consent in accordance with section 64(3AC), all such samples and all information derived from such samples shall be destroyed as soon as possible following a decision not to institute criminal proceedings against the person or on the conclusion of such proceedings otherwise than with a conviction.

(2) Subsection (1) above shall not apply-

(a) where the record, sample or information in question is of the same kind as a record, a sample or, as the case may be, information lawfully held in relation to the person; or

(b) where the person is cautioned for a recordable offence or given a warning or reprimand in accordance with the Crime and Disorder Act 1998 for a recordable offence in connection with the decision not to institute criminal proceedings or following the withdrawal or cessation of criminal proceedings; or

(c) where sections 64C or 64D apply.

(3) For the purposes of this section, criminal proceedings shall not be deemed to have concluded until the earlier of the (1) the lapse of any applicable appeal period and (2) a decision is made not to appeal such proceedings.

64C Retention of samples etc (violent and sexual offences)

(1) This section applies where any sample has been taken from a person under this Part where criminal proceedings were instituted against such person in respect of a sexual offence or violent offence and such proceedings concluded otherwise than with a conviction or with the person being cautioned for a recordable offence or given a warning or reprimand in accordance with the Crime and Disorder Act 1998 for a recordable offence.

(2) Subject to subsections (6) and (7) below, the sample and any information derived therefrom shall be destroyed no later than:

(a) 3 years following the conclusion of the proceedings ("the initial retention date"); or

(b) such later date as may be ordered under subsection (3).

(3) On application made by a chief officer of police within the period of 3 months before the initial retention date, the Crown Court, if satisfied that there are reasonable grounds for doing so, may make an order amending, or further amending, the date of destruction of the relevant sample and any information derived therefrom.

(4) An order under subsection (3) shall not specify a date more than 2 years later than the initial retention date.

(5) Any decisions of the Crown Court may be appealed to the Court of Appeal within 21 days of such decision.

(6) Subsection (2) does not apply where-

(a) an application under subsection (3) above has been made but has not been determined.

(b) the period within which an appeal may be brought under subsection (5) above against a decision to refuse an application has not elapsed; or

(c) such an appeal has been brought but has not been withdrawn or finally determined.

(7) Where-

(a) the period within which an appeal referred to in subsection (5) has elapsed without such an appeal being brought; or

(b) such an appeal is brought and is withdrawn or finally determined without any extension of the time period referred to in subsection (2),

the sample and any information derived therefrom shall be destroyed as soon as possible thereafter.

(8) For the purposes of this Part a "sexual offence" or "violent offence" shall mean such offences of a violent or sexual nature as shall be set out in any order made by the Secretary of State with reference to this section.

64D Retention of Samples - Residual Power

(1) On application by a chief officer of police, the Crown Court may make an order requiring the retention of a sample taken from a person and any information derived therefrom in circumstances where such a sample and any information derived therefrom would otherwise be required to be destroyed if it has reasonable grounds to believe that:

(a) there is a serious risk of harm to the public or a section of the public; and

(b) such retention would prevent, inhibit, restrict or disrupt involvement by the person in the commission of a sexual offence or violent offence.

(2) An order under this section is not to be in force for more than 5 years beginning with the date of the commencement of the order.

(3) Any decision of the Crown Court may be appealed to the Court of Appeal within 21 days of such decision.

(4) Where an application has been made for an order under this section, the relevant sample and any information derived therefrom shall not be destroyed until such application and any appeal thereof has been determined.

(3) At end of section 113(1) insert-

"provided always that the protections in Part 5 relating to the retention of samples and any information derived therefrom shall also be applied to persons investigated or under arrest under such Acts.".'.- (James Brokenshire.)

Brought up.

Question put, That the clause be added to the Bill.

The House divided: Ayes 154, Noes 352.

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Difference in Votes - sorted by party

MPs for which their vote on Motion (a) differed from their vote on Motion (b). You can also see just opposite votes between these two divisions, or simply all the votes.

Sort by: Name | Constituency | Party | Vote (a) | Vote (b)

NameConstituencyPartyVote (a)Vote (b)
Tony BaldryBanburyConaye absent
John BaronBillericayCon (front bench)aye absent
Peter BottomleyWorthing WestCon (front bench)aye absent
Graham BradyAltrincham and Sale WestCon (front bench)aye absent
Angela BrowningTiverton and HonitonCon (front bench)aye absent
David CameronWitneyCon (front bench)aye absent
Christopher ChopeChristchurchCon (front bench)aye absent
Philip DaviesShipleyConaye absent
James DuddridgeRochford and Southend EastCon (front bench)aye absent
Michael FallonSevenoaksCon (front bench)aye absent
Nick GibbBognor Regis and LittlehamptonCon (front bench)aye absent
Robert GoodwillScarborough and WhitbyCon (front bench)aye absent
Douglas HoggSleaford and North HykehamCon (front bench)aye absent
Philip HolloboneKetteringCon (front bench)aye absent
Adam HollowayGraveshamCon (front bench)aye absent
Michael HowardFolkestone and HytheConaye absent
Gerald HowarthAldershotCon (front bench)aye absent
Jeremy HuntSouth West SurreyCon (front bench)aye absent
Stewart JacksonPeterboroughCon (front bench)aye absent
Eleanor LaingEpping ForestCon (front bench)aye absent
Andrew LansleySouth CambridgeshireCon (front bench)aye absent
Ian Liddell-GraingerBridgwaterCon (front bench)aye absent
Peter LilleyHitchin and HarpendenConaye absent
Tim LoughtonEast Worthing and ShorehamCon (front bench)aye absent
Patrick MercerNewarkCon (front bench)aye absent
Bob NeillBromley and ChislehurstCon (front bench)aye absent
Grant ShappsWelwyn HatfieldCon (front bench)aye absent
Andrew TyrieChichesterCon (front bench)aye absent
Ed VaizeyWantageCon (front bench)aye absent
Peter ViggersGosportCon (front bench)aye absent
Nigel WatersonEastbourneCon (front bench)aye absent
Angela WatkinsonUpminsterCon (front bench)aye absent
Ann WiddecombeMaidstone and The WealdConaye absent
Nicholas WintertonMacclesfieldCon (front bench)aye absent
Tim YeoSouth SuffolkCon (front bench)aye absent
Brian BinleyNorthampton SouthCon (front bench)absent aye
Tim BoswellDaventryCon (front bench)absent aye
Kenneth ClarkeRushcliffeCon (front bench)absent aye
David DavisHaltemprice and HowdenConabsent aye
Nigel EvansRibble ValleyConabsent aye
Oliver HealdNorth East HertfordshireCon (front bench)absent aye
David Heathcoat-AmoryWellsCon (front bench)absent aye
John HoramOrpingtonCon (front bench)absent aye
Michael JackFyldeCon (front bench)absent aye
Julie KirkbrideBromsgroveCon (front bench)absent aye
Peter LuffMid WorcestershireCon (front bench)absent aye
Humfrey MalinsWokingCon (front bench)absent aye
John MaplesStratford-on-AvonCon (front bench)absent aye
Francis MaudeHorshamCon (front bench)absent aye
Malcolm MossNorth East CambridgeshireCon (front bench)absent aye
Owen PatersonNorth ShropshireCon (front bench)absent aye
David WilshireSpelthorneCon (front bench)absent aye
Gregory CampbellEast LondonderryDUP (front bench)aye absent
Nigel DoddsBelfast NorthDUP (front bench)aye absent
Jeffrey M. DonaldsonLagan ValleyDUP (front bench)aye absent
William McCreaSouth AntrimDUP (front bench)aye absent
Sammy WilsonEast AntrimDUP (front bench)aye absent
Dai DaviesBlaenau GwentIndependentaye no
Bob SpinkCastle Pointwhilst Independent (front bench)aye no
Robert WareingLiverpool, West Derbywhilst Independentaye absent
Clare ShortBirmingham, Ladywoodwhilst Independent Labourabsent aye
Diane AbbottHackney North and Stoke NewingtonLabaye no
Ian CawseyBrigg and GooleLab (minister)aye no
Jeremy CorbynIslington NorthLabaye no
Paul FarrellyNewcastle-under-LymeLab (minister)aye no
Mark FisherStoke-on-Trent CentralLabaye no
Neil GerrardWalthamstowLab (minister)aye no
Kate HoeyVauxhallLab (minister)aye no
Joan HumbleBlackpool North and FleetwoodLab (minister)aye no
Glenda JacksonHampstead and HighgateLabaye no
Andrew MacKinlayThurrockLab (minister)aye no
Gordon MarsdenBlackpool SouthLabaye no
Robert Marshall-AndrewsMedwayLabaye no
John Martin McDonnellHayes and HarlingtonLabaye no
Shona McIsaacCleethorpesLab (minister)aye no
Julie MorganCardiff NorthLab (minister)aye no
Nick PalmerBroxtoweLab (minister)aye no
Steve PoundEaling NorthLab (minister)aye no
Nick RaynsfordGreenwich and WoolwichLabaye no
Andy ReedLoughboroughLab (minister)aye no
Linda RiordanHalifaxLab (minister)aye no
Alan SimpsonNottingham SouthLabaye no
Andrew SmithOxford EastLabaye no
Paul TruswellPudseyLabaye no
Keith VazLeicester EastLab (minister)aye no
Mike WoodBatley and SpenLabaye no
Harry CohenLeyton and WansteadLab (minister)aye absent
Kelvin HopkinsLuton NorthLab (minister)aye absent
Nick AingerCarmarthen West and South PembrokeshireLab (minister)no absent
David AndersonBlaydonLab (minister)no absent
Hugh BayleyCity of YorkLab (minister)no absent
Stuart BellMiddlesbroughLab (minister)no absent
Roger BerryKingswoodLab (minister)no absent
Liz BlackmanErewashLab (minister)no absent
David BorrowSouth RibbleLab (minister)no absent
Gordon BrownKirkcaldy and CowdenbeathLab (minister)no absent
Colin ChallenMorley and RothwellLab (minister)no absent
David ChaytorBury NorthLab (minister)no absent
Michael ConnartyLinlithgow and East FalkirkLab (minister)no absent
Jim CousinsNewcastle upon Tyne CentralLab (minister)no absent
Alistair DarlingEdinburgh South WestLab (minister)no absent
Barbara FollettStevenageLab (minister)no absent
Paul GogginsWythenshawe and Sale EastLab (minister)no absent
Patricia HewittLeicester WestLabno absent
John HuttonBarrow and FurnessLab (minister)no absent
Adam IngramEast Kilbride, Strathaven and LesmahagowLabno absent
Sally KeebleNorthampton NorthLab (minister)no absent
Sadiq KhanTootingLab (minister)no absent
Mark LazarowiczEdinburgh North and LeithLab (minister)no absent
Andrew LoveEdmontonLab (minister)no absent
Shahid MalikDewsburyLab (minister)no absent
Pat McFaddenWolverhampton South EastLab (minister)no absent
John McFallWest DunbartonshireLab (minister)no absent
Margaret MoranLuton SouthLab (minister)no absent
Jessica MordenNewport EastLab (minister)no absent
Elliot MorleyScunthorpeLabno absent
George MudieLeeds EastLab (minister)no absent
Mike O'BrienNorth WarwickshireLab (minister)no absent
Jonathan R ShawChatham and AylesfordLab (minister)no absent
Geraldine SmithMorecambe and LunesdaleLab (minister)no absent
John SmithVale of GlamorganLab (minister)no absent
Gerry SutcliffeBradford SouthLab (minister)no absent
Kitty UssherBurnleyLab (minister)no absent
Michael WillsNorth SwindonLab (minister)no absent
David TaylorNorth West LeicestershireLab (minister)both no
John AustinErith and ThamesmeadLab (minister)absent no
John BattleLeeds WestLab (minister)absent no
Hilary BennLeeds CentralLab (minister)absent no
Karen BuckRegent's Park and Kensington NorthLab (minister)absent no
Richard BurdenBirmingham, NorthfieldLab (minister)absent no
Colin BurgonElmetLababsent no
Stephen ByersNorth TynesideLababsent no
Richard CabornSheffield CentralLababsent no
Ronnie CampbellBlyth ValleyLababsent no
Martin CatonGowerLab (minister)absent no
Michael ClaphamBarnsley West and PenistoneLab (minister)absent no
Charles ClarkeNorwich SouthLab (minister)absent no
Frank CookStockton NorthLab (minister)absent no
Jon CruddasDagenhamLababsent no
Bill EtheringtonSunderland NorthLababsent no
Frank FieldBirkenheadLab (minister)absent no
Mike GapesIlford SouthLab (minister)absent no
Mike HallWeaver ValeLab (minister)absent no
Patrick HallBedfordLab (minister)absent no
Fabian HamiltonLeeds North EastLab (minister)absent no
Doug HendersonNewcastle upon Tyne NorthLababsent no
David HeyesAshton-under-LyneLab (minister)absent no
Jimmy HoodLanark and Hamilton EastLab (minister)absent no
Geoff HoonAshfieldLab (minister)absent no
Lindsay HoyleChorleyLab (minister)absent no
Eric IllsleyBarnsley CentralLab (minister)absent no
Siân JamesSwansea EastLab (minister)absent no
Martyn JonesClwyd SouthLab (minister)absent no
Peter KilfoyleLiverpool, WaltonLababsent no
Ashok KumarMiddlesbrough South and East ClevelandLababsent no
Martin LintonBatterseaLababsent no
Denis MacShaneRotherhamLababsent no
Judy MallaberAmber ValleyLab (minister)absent no
John MannBassetlawLab (minister)absent no
Chris McCaffertyCalder ValleyLababsent no
Anne McGuireStirlingLababsent no
Michael MeacherOldham West and RoytonLababsent no
Ed MilibandDoncaster NorthLab (minister)absent no
Austin MitchellGreat GrimsbyLab (minister)absent no
Kali MountfordColne ValleyLab (minister)absent no
Edward O'HaraKnowsley SouthLab (minister)absent no
Greg PopeHyndburnLab (minister)absent no
Bridget PrenticeLewisham EastLab (minister)absent no
Jamie ReedCopelandLab (minister)absent no
John ReidAirdrie and ShottsLababsent no
John RobertsonGlasgow North WestLab (minister)absent no
Martin SalterReading WestLab (minister)absent no
Marsha SinghBradford WestLab (minister)absent no
Anne SnelgroveSouth SwindonLababsent no
Gavin StrangEdinburgh EastLab (minister)absent no
Gisela StuartBirmingham, EdgbastonLab (minister)absent no
Paddy TippingSherwoodLab (minister)absent no
Neil TurnerWiganLab (minister)absent no
Rudi VisFinchley and Golders GreenLababsent no
Anthony D WrightGreat YarmouthLab (minister)absent no
Lynne JonesBirmingham, Selly OakLab (minister)absent both
Danny AlexanderInverness, Nairn, Badenoch and StrathspeyLDem (front bench)aye no
John BarrettEdinburgh WestLDem (front bench)aye no
Alan BeithBerwick-upon-TweedLDem (front bench)aye no
Tom BrakeCarshalton and WallingtonLDem (front bench)aye no
Annette BrookeMid Dorset and North PooleLDem (front bench)aye no
Jeremy BrowneTauntonLDem (front bench)aye no
Malcolm BruceGordonLDem (front bench)aye no
Paul BurstowSutton and CheamLDem (front bench)aye no
Lorely BurtSolihullLDem (front bench)aye no
Vincent CableTwickenhamLDem (front bench)aye no
Menzies CampbellNorth East FifeLDem (front bench)aye no
Nick CleggSheffield, HallamLDem (front bench)aye no
Edward DaveyKingston and SurbitonLDem (front bench)aye no
Lynne FeatherstoneHornsey and Wood GreenLDem (front bench)aye no
Don FosterBathLDem (front bench)aye no
Andrew GeorgeSt IvesLDem (front bench)aye no
Julia GoldsworthyFalmouth and CamborneLDem (front bench)aye no
Evan HarrisOxford West and AbingdonLDem (front bench)aye no
Nick HarveyNorth DevonLDem (front bench)aye no
David HeathSomerton and FromeLDem (front bench)aye no
John HemmingBirmingham, YardleyLDem (front bench)aye no
Paul HolmesChesterfieldLDem (front bench)aye no
Martin HorwoodCheltenhamLDem (front bench)aye no
David HowarthCambridgeLDem (front bench)aye no
Simon HughesNorth Southwark and BermondseyLDem (front bench)aye no
Christopher HuhneEastleighLDem (front bench)aye no
Mark HunterCheadleLDem (front bench)aye no
Susan KramerRichmond ParkLDemaye no
Norman LambNorth NorfolkLDem (front bench)aye no
David LawsYeovilLDem (front bench)aye no
John LeechManchester, WithingtonLDem (front bench)aye no
Michael MooreBerwickshire, Roxburgh and SelkirkLDem (front bench)aye no
Greg MulhollandLeeds North WestLDem (front bench)aye no
John PughSouthportLDem (front bench)aye no
Alan ReidArgyll and ButeLDem (front bench)tellaye no
Willie RennieDunfermline and West FifeLDem (front bench)aye no
Dan RogersonNorth CornwallLDem (front bench)tellaye no
Bob RussellColchesterLDem (front bench)aye no
Adrian SandersTorbayLDem (front bench)aye no
Robert SmithWest Aberdeenshire and KincardineLDem (front bench)aye no
Andrew StunellHazel GroveLDem (front bench)aye no
Matthew TaylorTruro and St AustellLDemaye no
Sarah TeatherBrent EastLDem (front bench)aye no
John ThursoCaithness, Sutherland and Easter RossLDem (front bench)aye no
Steve WebbNorthavonLDem (front bench)aye no
Mark WilliamsCeredigionLDem (front bench)aye no
Stephen WilliamsBristol WestLDem (front bench)aye no
Phil WillisHarrogate and KnaresboroughLDem (front bench)aye no
Norman BakerLewesLDem (front bench)aye absent
Colin BreedSouth East CornwallLDem (front bench)aye absent
Tim FarronWestmorland and LonsdaleLDem (front bench)aye absent
Jennifer WillottCardiff CentralLDem (front bench)aye absent
Richard Younger-RossTeignbridgeLDem (front bench)aye absent
Alistair CarmichaelOrkney and ShetlandLDem (front bench)absent no
Sandra GidleyRomseyLDem (front bench)absent no
Mike HancockPortsmouth SouthLDem (front bench)absent no
Paul KeetchHerefordLDem (front bench)absent no
Mark OatenWinchesterLDem (front bench)absent no
Lembit ÖpikMontgomeryshireLDem (front bench)absent no
Paul RowenRochdaleLDem (front bench)absent no
Jo SwinsonEast DunbartonshireLDem (front bench)absent no
Roger WilliamsBrecon and RadnorshireLDem (front bench)absent no
Hywel WilliamsCaernarfonPC (front bench)aye no
Elfyn LlwydMeirionnydd Nant ConwyPC (front bench)aye absent
Alasdair McDonnellBelfast SouthSDLP (front bench)aye absent
Mark DurkanFoyleSDLP (front bench)absent no
John MasonGlasgow EastSNP (front bench)aye absent
Angus RobertsonMoraySNP (front bench)aye absent
Michael WeirAngusSNP (front bench)aye absent
Pete WishartPerth and North PerthshireSNP (front bench)aye absent
Sylvia HermonNorth DownUUP (front bench)aye absent

Division Similarity Ratio

The measure of similarity between these two divisions is a calculation based on a comparison of their votes.

There were 646 MPs who could have voted in both of these divisions, and 348 voted the same way, with 76 voting in opposite ways. There were 47 MPs who didn't vote in either division, and 175 who voted in only one of them.

We invert the vote on the second division if it makes the distance closer (since the meaning of 'Aye' and 'No' are often interchangeable depending on how the question was put). In this case, they line up the same way. An 's vote in in only one of the divisions contributes a factor of 0.2 to the distance. The calculation runs as follows:

ratio =
[same-votes]
([same-votes] + [differing-votes] + 0.2x[abstain-in-one])
=
348
(348 + 76 + 0.2x175)
=
348
459
= 0.758 = 75.8 %.


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