Postal Services Bill — Extension of existing powers relating to the Post Office — 27 Jul 2000

Lords amendments considered.

Lords amendment: No. 1, in page 2, line 32, leave out from beginning to ("are") in line 33 and insert

("a service of conveying relevant postal packets from one place to another by post and the incidental services of receiving, collecting, sorting and delivering such packets")

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 2, 30, 31, 44, 45, 49, 91, 92, 94, 101 and 126 to 132, No. 133 and amendment (a) thereto, and Nos. 134 to 140.

Sub-paragraph (1) does not free the universal service provider concerned from obtaining any other consent, licence or permission which may be required.

inspecting, maintaining, adjusting, repairing, altering or renewing such apparatus which has been so placed, changing its position or removing it.

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendment No. 2 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 3, in page 9, line 26, after ("lie") insert

("or, in Scotland, be competent").

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker (Mr. Michael Lord):

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 4, 5, 8, 9, 11, 12, 15 to 19, 21, 23 to 26, 32, 41 to 43, 47, 48, 55, 56, 87 to 90, 93, 95 to 98, 100 and 141 to 144.

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendments Nos. 4 and 5 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 6, in page 21, line 6, at end insert--

("(1A) No such penalty shall exceed 10 per cent. of the turnover of the licence holder (determined in accordance with provisions specified in an order made by the Secretary of State).").

No penalty fixed by the Director under this section may exceed 10 per cent. of the turnover of the undertaking (determined in accordance with such provisions as may be specified in an order made by the Secretary of State).

companies engaging in anti-competitive practices will face a maximum penalty of 10 per cent. of their UK turnover for each year of the infringement, up to a maximum of three years.

That could amount to tens of millions of pounds in some cases.

The proposed maximum penalty for breaches of the Act is excessive. It could lead to extremely large fines, and affect the viability of businesses, potentially leading to insolvencies and consequent job losses . . . The CBI believes the imposition of a maximum fine on a three-year basis to be contrary to the principle of section 60 of the Act; the equivalent time period at EU level is only one year.

The proposed level of maximum fine may also be contrary to the general Community law principle of proportionality.

Such a level of penalty goes beyond normal bounds, whether in terms of deterrent, retribution or proportionality, and arguably runs counter to the Government's stated goal of creating a healthy, pro-business environment.

Where an undertaking consists of two or more undertakings that each prepare accounts then the applicable turnover shall be calculated by adding together the respective applicable turnover of each, save that no account shall be taken of any turnover resulting from the sale of products or the provision of services between them.

shall exercise its functions in the manner which it considers is best calculated to promote efficiency and economy on the part of postal operators.

Accordingly, this amendment proposes that the commission collect information about the effectiveness of the Post Office, as compared with similar operations, and then report on the information that it has collected. It is difficult to see how the commission will be able to discharge the function referred to in, and provided for by, clause 5(3) without the benefit of such information. The proposal provides the information necessary to enable the commission to carry out its functions and the reassurance that that information will definitely be sought.

We have no difficulty in accepting this amendment--

We argued for it quite strongly either in Committee or on Report. We thank the Minister for bringing it back in this form.--[ Official Report, House of Lords , 11 July 2000; Vol. 615, c. 171.]

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendments Nos. 7 to 19 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 20, in page 32, line 13, leave out (" 95(2)") and insert ("( Inviolability of mails )(2)")

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 36 to 40, 50, 53, 57 to 61, 72, 73 and 79.

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendment No. 21 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 22, in page 34, line 34, leave out paragraph (c) and insert--

("(c) shall establish at least one committee, and may establish other committees, in relation to England (whether a committee for England or a committee for an area within England).")

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 27 to 29, No. 68 and amendment (a) thereto, and Nos. 109 to 120, 149 and 166.

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendments Nos. 23 to 32 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 33, in page 44, line 30, at end insert--

("( ) amounts outstanding in respect of the principal of debt securities issued in pursuance of section 63 of this Act, and")

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 34 and 35, No. 66 and amendment (a) thereto, and Nos. 67, 121 to 125, 146, 153 and 154.

For the purposes of this section equivalents in sterling shall be calculated as the Secretary of State considers appropriate.

Lords amendment agreed to [Special Entry].

Lords amendments Nos. 34 to 53 agreed to [some with Special Entry].

Lords amendment: No. 54, in page 62, line 20, leave out ("other country") and insert

("country or territory outside the United Kingdom")

I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Mr. Deputy Speaker:

With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 69 to 71, 75 to 78, 80 to 82, 85, 102 to 104, 106 to 108, 145, 147, 148, 150 to 152, 155 to 165 and 167 to 171.

Lords amendment agreed to.

Lords amendments Nos. 55 to 65 agreed to.

Lords amendment: No. 66, in page 65, line 15, at end insert--

("(7) After section 74(4) of that Act there shall be inserted--

"(4A) For the purposes of this section equivalents in sterling shall be calculated as the Secretary of State considers appropriate." ")

Amendment proposed to the Lords amendment: (a), in line 4, leave out from "calculated" to end and insert--

'in accordance with market rates'.-- [Mr. Bercow.]

Question put, That the amendment to the Lords amendment be made:--

The House divided: Ayes 107, Noes 226.

Historical Hansard | Online Hansard |

Public Whip is run as a free not-for-profit free service. If you'd like to support us, please consider switching your electricity and/or gas to Bulb Energy who provide 100% renewable electricity and tend to be 20% cheaper than the 'Big Six'. They'll also pay any exit fees (up to £120) from your old supplier AND give you (and us) a £50 credit for joining up via our Bulb Referral Link.

All Votes Cast - sorted by party

MPs for which their vote in this division differed from the majority vote of their party are marked in red. Also shows which MPs were ministers at the time of this vote. You can also see every eligible MP including those who did not vote in this division.

Sort by: Name | Constituency | Party | Vote

NameConstituencyPartyVote
Peter AinsworthEast SurreyConaye
Sir David AmessSouthend WestCon (front bench)aye
James ArbuthnotNorth East HampshireCon (front bench)aye
Peter AtkinsonHexhamConaye
Tony BaldryBanburyCon (front bench)aye
John BercowBuckinghamCon (front bench)aye
Paul BeresfordMole ValleyCon (front bench)aye
Crispin BluntReigateCon (front bench)aye
Mr Richard BodyBoston and SkegnessConaye
Tim BoswellDaventryCon (front bench)aye
Peter BottomleyWorthing WestCon (front bench)aye
Mrs Virginia BottomleySouth West SurreyConaye
Graham BradyAltrincham and Sale WestCon (front bench)aye
Julian BrazierCanterburyCon (front bench)aye
Angela BrowningTiverton and HonitonCon (front bench)aye
Mr Ian BruceSouth DorsetConaye
Bill CashStoneCon (front bench)aye
Sir Sydney ChapmanChipping BarnetConaye
James ClappisonHertsmereCon (front bench)aye
Kenneth ClarkeRushcliffeConaye
Geoffrey Clifton-BrownCotswoldCon (front bench)tellaye
Mr Tim CollinsWestmorland and LonsdaleConaye
Mr James CranBeverley and HoldernessConaye
David DavisHaltemprice and HowdenCon (front bench)aye
Mr Stephen DayCheadleConaye
Iain Duncan SmithChingford and Woodford GreenCon (front bench)aye
Nigel EvansRibble ValleyCon (front bench)aye
Michael FabricantLichfieldCon (front bench)aye
Michael FallonSevenoaksCon (front bench)aye
Mr Howard FlightArundel and South DownsConaye
Eric ForthBromley and ChislehurstConaye
Christopher FraserMid Dorset and North PooleConaye
Roger GaleNorth ThanetCon (front bench)aye
Edward GarnierHarboroughCon (front bench)aye
Nick GibbBognor Regis and LittlehamptonCon (front bench)aye
Mr Christopher GillLudlowConaye
Dame Cheryl GillanChesham and AmershamCon (front bench)aye
Mrs Teresa GormanBillericayConaye
James GrayNorth WiltshireCon (front bench)aye
Damian GreenAshfordCon (front bench)aye
John GreenwayRyedaleConaye
Dominic GrieveBeaconsfieldCon (front bench)aye
John GummerSuffolk CoastalConaye
Sir Archie HamiltonEpsom and EwellCon (front bench)aye
Philip HammondRunnymede and WeybridgeCon (front bench)aye
Mr Nick HawkinsSurrey HeathConaye
John HayesSouth Holland and The DeepingsCon (front bench)aye
Oliver HealdNorth East HertfordshireCon (front bench)aye
Michael HowardFolkestone and HytheConaye
Michael JackFyldeConaye
Bernard JenkinNorth EssexCon (front bench)aye
Sir Geoffrey Johnson SmithWealdenConaye
Robert KeySalisburyConaye
Mr Tom KingBridgwaterCon (front bench)aye
Eleanor LaingEpping ForestCon (front bench)aye
Jacqui LaitBeckenhamConaye
Andrew LansleySouth CambridgeshireCon (front bench)aye
Edward LeighGainsboroughCon (front bench)aye
Oliver LetwinWest DorsetConaye
David LidingtonAylesburyCon (front bench)aye
Peter LilleyHitchin and HarpendenConaye
Sir Peter LloydFarehamConaye
Tim LoughtonEast Worthing and ShorehamCon (front bench)aye
Peter LuffMid WorcestershireCon (front bench)aye
Sir Nicholas LyellNorth East BedfordshireConaye
Mr John MacGregorSouth NorfolkConaye
David MacleanPenrith and The BorderConaye
Mr David MadelSouth West BedfordshireConaye
Humfrey MalinsWokingConaye
Theresa MayMaidenheadCon (front bench)aye
Anne McIntoshVale of YorkCon (front bench)aye
Patrick McLoughlinWest DerbyshireCon (front bench)aye
Mr Patrick NichollsTeignbridgeConaye
Mr Archie NormanTunbridge WellsConaye
Stephen O'BrienEddisburyCon (front bench)aye
Richard OttawayCroydon SouthCon (front bench)aye
James PaiceSouth East CambridgeshireCon (front bench)aye
Owen PatersonNorth ShropshireCon (front bench)aye
Mr Michael PortilloKensington and ChelseaConaye
Mr David PriorNorth NorfolkCon (front bench)aye
John RandallUxbridgeCon (front bench)tellaye
Andrew RobathanBlabyCon (front bench)aye
David RuffleyBury St EdmundsCon (front bench)aye
Richard ShepherdAldridge-BrownhillsCon (front bench)aye
Keith SimpsonMid NorfolkCon (front bench)aye
Caroline SpelmanMeridenCon (front bench)aye
Michael SpicerWest WorcestershireCon (front bench)aye
Richard SpringWest SuffolkConaye
Mr Nick St AubynGuildfordConaye
John StanleyTonbridge and MallingCon (front bench)aye
Gary StreeterSouth West DevonCon (front bench)aye
Desmond SwayneNew Forest WestCon (front bench)aye
Robert SymsPooleCon (front bench)aye
Peter TapsellLouth and HorncastleConaye
Mr Teddy TaylorRochford and Southend EastConaye
David TredinnickBosworthCon (front bench)aye
Mr Michael TrendWindsorConaye
Andrew TyrieChichesterCon (front bench)aye
Peter ViggersGosportConaye
Nigel WatersonEastbourneConaye
Mr Bowen WellsHertford and StortfordConaye
Sir Ray WhitneyWycombeConaye
John WhittingdaleMaldon and East ChelmsfordConaye
Ann WiddecombeMaidstone and The WealdConaye
Mr John WilkinsonRuislip - NorthwoodConaye
David WillettsHavantCon (front bench)aye
David WilshireSpelthorneConaye
Tim YeoSouth SuffolkCon (front bench)aye
George YoungNorth West HampshireCon (front bench)aye
Nick AingerCarmarthen West and South PembrokeshireLabno
Bob AinsworthCoventry North EastLab (minister)no
Douglas AlexanderPaisley SouthLabno
Graham AllenNottingham NorthLab (minister)no
Mr Donald AndersonSwansea EastLab (minister)no
Janet AndersonRossendale and DarwenLab (minister)no
Hilary ArmstrongNorth West DurhamLab (minister)no
Mr Joe AshtonBassetlawLabno
Charlotte AtkinsStaffordshire MoorlandsLabno
John AustinErith and ThamesmeadLabno
Mr Tony BanksWest HamLab (minister)no
Mr Harry BarnesNorth East DerbyshireLabno
Kevin BarronRother ValleyLab (minister)no
Mr Nigel BeardBexleyheath and CrayfordLabno
Hilary BennLeeds CentralLab (minister)no
Mr Andrew BennettDenton and ReddishLabno
Joe BentonBootleLabno
Mr Gerry BerminghamSt Helens SouthLabno
Mr Harold BestLeeds North WestLabno
Clive BettsSheffield, AttercliffeLab (minister)no
Hazel BlearsSalfordLabno
Bob BlizzardWaveneyLabno
Mr Paul BoatengBrent SouthLab (minister)no
Mr Keith BradleyManchester, WithingtonLab (minister)no
Ben BradshawExeterLab (minister)no
Nick BrownNewcastle upon Tyne East and WallsendLab (minister)no
Karen BuckRegent's Park and Kensington NorthLab (minister)no
Richard BurdenBirmingham, NorthfieldLabno
Richard CabornSheffield CentralLab (minister)no
Mr Dale Campbell-SavoursWorkingtonLab (minister)no
Mr Jamie CannIpswichLabno
Martin CatonGowerLab (minister)no
Ian CawseyBrigg and GooleLabno
Ben ChapmanWirral SouthLabno
Michael ClaphamBarnsley West and PenistoneLabno
Dr David ClarkSouth ShieldsLabno
Ms Helen ClarkPeterboroughLabno
Paul ClarkGillinghamLabno
Mr Tony ClarkeNorthampton SouthLabno
Ann ClwydCynon ValleyLab (minister)no
Vernon CoakerGedlingLabno
Ann CoffeyStockportLab (minister)no
Harry CohenLeyton and WansteadLabno
Mr Iain ColemanHammersmith and FulhamLabno
Mr Tony ColmanPutneyLabno
Frank CookStockton NorthLabno
Yvette CooperPontefract and CastlefordLab (minister)no
Jeremy CorbynIslington NorthLabno
Ms Jean CorstonBristol EastLabno
Jim CousinsNewcastle upon Tyne CentralLabno
Mr Tom CoxTootingLabno
Professor Ross CranstonDudley NorthLab (minister)no
John CryerHornchurchLab (minister)no
Jim CunninghamCoventry SouthLab (minister)no
Claire Curtis-ThomasCrosbyLabno
Mr Keith DarvillUpminsterLabno
Mrs Valerie DaveyBristol WestLabno
Mr Denzil DaviesLlanelliLabno
Geraint DaviesCroydon CentralLab (minister)no
Mr Hilton DawsonLancaster and WyreLabno
Andrew DismoreHendonLabno
Frank DoranAberdeen CentralLabno
Jim DowdLewisham WestLab (minister)no
Angela EagleWallaseyLab (minister)no
Maria EagleLiverpool, GarstonLabno
Mr Huw EdwardsMonmouthLabno
Louise EllmanLiverpool, RiversideLab (minister)no
Jeff EnnisBarnsley East and MexboroughLabno
Mark FisherStoke-on-Trent CentralLabno
Jim FitzpatrickPoplar and Canning TownLabno
Ms Lorna FitzsimonsRochdaleLabno
Caroline FlintDon ValleyLabno
Paul FlynnNewport WestLabno
Barbara FollettStevenageLabno
Michael FosterWorcesterLabno
Michael Jabez FosterHastings and RyeLabno
Mrs Maria FyfeGlasgow MaryhillLabno
Neil GerrardWalthamstowLabno
Ian GibsonNorwich NorthLabno
Roger GodsiffBirmingham, Sparkbrook and Small HeathLabno
Paul GogginsWythenshawe and Sale EastLabno
Mrs Eileen GordonRomfordLabno
Ms Jane GriffithsReading EastLabno
Mr Win GriffithsBridgendLabno
Mr Bruce GrocottTelfordLabno
John GroganSelbyLab (minister)no
Mike HallWeaver ValeLab (minister)no
Patrick HallBedfordLabno
Sylvia HealHalesowen and Rowley Regiswhilst Labno
John HealeyWentworthLabno
Stephen HepburnJarrowLab (minister)no
Stephen HesfordWirral WestLabno
Patricia HewittLeicester WestLab (minister)no
Geoff HoonAshfieldLab (minister)no
Phil HopeCorbyLabno
Kelvin HopkinsLuton NorthLabno
Mr Alan HowarthNewport EastLab (minister)no
Kim HowellsPontypriddLab (minister)no
Beverley HughesStretford and UrmstonLab (minister)no
Mr Kevin HughesDoncaster NorthLab (minister)no
Mr Alan HurstBraintreeLabno
John HuttonBarrow and FurnessLab (minister)no
Brian IddonBolton South EastLabno
Mrs Helen JacksonSheffield, HillsboroughLabno
Mr David JamiesonPlymouth, DevonportLab (minister)tellno
Brian JenkinsTamworthLabno
Alan JohnsonKingston upon Hull West and HessleLab (minister)no
Miss Melanie JohnsonWelwyn HatfieldLab (minister)no
Lynne JonesBirmingham, Selly OakLabno
Tessa JowellDulwich and West NorwoodLab (minister)no
Sally KeebleNorthampton NorthLabno
Alan KeenFeltham and HestonLabno
Ann KeenBrentford and IsleworthLabno
Piara S KhabraEaling, SouthallLabno
David KidneyStaffordLabno
Mr Andy KingRugby and KenilworthLabno
Stephen LadymanSouth ThanetLabno
Bob LaxtonDerby NorthLabno
Chris LeslieShipleyLabno
Ivan LewisBury SouthLabno
Mr Terry LewisWorsleyLabno
Martin LintonBatterseaLabno
Tony LloydManchester CentralLabno
Andrew MacKinlayThurrockLabno
Mrs Alice MahonHalifaxLabno
Judy MallaberAmber ValleyLabno
David MarshallGlasgow ShettlestonLabno
Thomas McAvoyGlasgow RutherglenLab (minister)no
Steve McCabeBirmingham, Hall GreenLab (minister)no
Chris McCaffertyCalder ValleyLabno
Ian McCartneyMakerfieldLab (minister)no
Siobhain McDonaghMitcham and MordenLabno
John Martin McDonnellHayes and HarlingtonLab (minister)no
Anne McGuireStirlingLab (minister)no
Shona McIsaacCleethorpesLabno
Rosemary McKennaCumbernauld and KilsythLabno
Mr Kevin McNamaraKingston upon Hull NorthLabno
Tony McNultyHarrow EastLab (minister)no
Mr Tony McWalterHemel HempsteadLabno
Michael MeacherOldham West and RoytonLab (minister)no
Gillian MerronLincolnLabno
Alun MichaelCardiff South and PenarthLabno
Mr Bill MichieSheffield, HeeleyLabno
Andrew MillerEllesmere Port and NestonLabno
Laura MoffattCrawleyLabno
Margaret MoranLuton SouthLabno
Julie MorganCardiff NorthLabno
Elliot MorleyScunthorpeLab (minister)no
Kali MountfordColne ValleyLabno
Doug NaysmithBristol North WestLabno
Mr Bill O'BrienNormantonLabno
Bill OlnerNuneatonLabno
Nick PalmerBroxtoweLabno
Ian PearsonDudley SouthLabno
Ms Linda PerhamIlford NorthLabno
Mr Colin PickthallWest LancashireLabno
Mr Peter PikeBurnleyLabno
James PlaskittWarwick and LeamingtonLabno
Mr Kerry PollardSt AlbansLabno
Mr Chris PondGraveshamLabno
Greg PopeHyndburnLab (minister)no
Steve PoundEaling NorthLab (minister)no
Mr Raymond PowellOgmoreLabno
Bridget PrenticeLewisham EastLabno
Gordon PrenticePendleLabno
Gwyn ProsserDoverLabno
Ms Joyce QuinGateshead East and Washington WestLab (minister)no
Mr Lawrie QuinnScarborough and WhitbyLabno
Bill RammellHarlowLabno
Mr Syd RapsonPortsmouth NorthLabno
Andy ReedLoughboroughLabno
Mr Allan RogersRhonddaLabno
Mr Jeff RookerBirmingham, Perry BarrLab (minister)no
Mr Ernie RossDundee WestLabno
Joan RuddockLewisham, DeptfordLabno
Martin SalterReading WestLabno
Mr Malcolm SavidgeAberdeen NorthLabno
Mr Phil SawfordKetteringLabno
Mr Brian SedgemoreHackney South and ShoreditchLabno
Jonathan R ShawChatham and AylesfordLabno
Ms Debra ShipleyStourbridgeLabno
Dennis SkinnerBolsoverLab (minister)no
Jacqui SmithRedditchLab (minister)no
Mr Peter SnapeWest Bromwich EastLabno
Mr Clive SoleyEaling, Acton and Shepherd's BushLab (minister)no
Helen SouthworthWarrington SouthLabno
John SpellarWarleyLab (minister)no
Phyllis StarkeyMilton Keynes South WestLabno
Ian StewartEcclesLabno
Mr Paul StinchcombeWellingboroughLabno
Howard StoateDartfordLabno
Gavin StrangEdinburgh East and MusselburghLabno
Gisela StuartBirmingham, EdgbastonLab (minister)no
Gerry SutcliffeBradford SouthLab (minister)tellno
Mrs Ann TaylorDewsburyLab (minister)no
Dari TaylorStockton SouthLabno
Mr Peter Temple-MorrisLeominsterwhilst Labno
Gareth ThomasHarrow WestLab (minister)no
Stephen TimmsEast HamLab (minister)no
Paddy TippingSherwoodLab (minister)no
Don TouhigIslwynLab (minister)no
Jon TrickettHemsworthLabno
Dr George TurnerNorth West NorfolkLabno
Neil TurnerWiganLabno
Stephen TwiggEnfield, SouthgateLab (minister)no
Rudi VisFinchley and Golders GreenLabno
Joan WalleyStoke-on-Trent NorthLab (minister)no
Robert WareingLiverpool, West DerbyLabno
Alan WhiteheadSouthampton, TestLabno
Alan WilliamsSwansea WestLabno
Betty WilliamsConwyLabno
Michael WillsNorth SwindonLab (minister)no
Rosie WintertonDoncaster CentralLabno
Mike WoodBatley and SpenLabno
Shaun WoodwardWitneywhilst Labno
Phil WoolasOldham East and SaddleworthLabno
Derek WyattSittingbourne and SheppeyLabno
Alan BeithBerwick-upon-TweedLDem (front bench)no
Mr John BurnettTorridge and West DevonLDemno
Vincent CableTwickenhamLDem (front bench)no
Edward DaveyKingston and SurbitonLDem (front bench)no
Don FosterBathLDem (front bench)no
Nick HarveyNorth DevonLDem (front bench)no
Lembit ÖpikMontgomeryshireLDemno
Mr David RendelNewburyLDemno
Andrew StunellHazel GroveLDem (front bench)no
Dr Jenny TongeRichmond ParkLDemno
Mr Paul TylerNorth CornwallLDem (front bench)no

About the Project

The Public Whip is a not-for-profit, open source website created in 2003 by Francis Irving and Julian Todd and now run by Bairwell Ltd.

PublicWhip v2 codebase is currently under development - you can join the Slack group to find out more or email [email protected]

The Whip on the Web

Help keep PublicWhip alive