Electronic Communications Bill — 29 Nov 1999

[Relevant documents: The Trade and Industry Committee reported on the Draft Electronic Communications Bill in its Fourteenth Report of Session 1998-99, HC 862. Its Seventh Report, on Building Confidence in Electronic Commerce: The Government's Proposals, HC 187, and the Government's response thereto, contained in Promoting Electronic Commerce, Cm 4417.]

Order for Second Reading read.

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.

When my grandmother left Britain nearly 100 years ago, it took her months to reach Australia, and it took months for her first letter to reach home. These days, a letter takes less than a week, but an e-mail takes less than a minute. That is just one small example of how our world is being transformed by electronic networks.

The Electronic Communications Bill will modernise our laws for the world of e-mail and the internet. It is just part of our strategy to make this country the best place in the world for electronic commerce.

Electronic networks--the convergence of communications and computing--are changing everything. They destroy jobs and create new ones at quite terrifying speed. Already in the United Kingdom, one in six people works for companies that did not exist five years ago. Networks have transformed global trade, creating financial markets in which billions of dollars are moved around the world daily. They are transforming manufacturing, allowing global teams of engineers to work around the world, around the clock, designing new products and testing them in simulation before the prototype is even built. They are transforming education, and they will certainly transform politics. Indeed, I must congratulate the hon. Member for Rutland and Melton (Mr. Duncan) on achieving a parliamentary first--an electronic petition. I am not sure whether the House is yet equipped to receive an electronic petition electronically--I fear not. When I saw the electronic petition in my in-box this morning, and when I saw "You've got mail", I confess that I was not thinking of the hon. Gentleman.

Our goal is clear. This country led the world into the first industrial revolution, and now we are determined to be winners in the new economy. Our strategy for that is also clear. We need modern, competitive markets that will enable the fast growth of electronic commerce; confident consumers with the skills and access to exploit the potential of the internet; and a leading-edge Government, who are exploiting to the full the potential of the new technologies to transform the ways in which we deliver services to citizens and citizens communicate with the Government.

Mr. Dale Campbell-Savours (Workington):

One of the biggest impediments to the use of the internet in my constituency, where incomes are generally low, is the cost. How can British Telecom retain the right to charge

I beg to move, To leave out from "That" to the end of the Question, and to add instead thereof:

"this House declines to give a Second Reading to the Electronic Communications Bill because it introduces a completely unnecessary element of regulation in the supervision of electronic commerce which will damage the United Kingdom's lead in this field and because no proper consideration has been given to the manner in which United Kingdom law will interact with impending EU law, in particular with regard to the jurisdiction that will govern electronic trade."

At that stage, Interforum said what we were saying:

"We advocate a simple e-commerce Bill containing part II,"--

Over the past two years, my right hon. Friend the Leader of the House, who has ultimate responsibility for dealing with the millennium bug, and I have engaged in friendly debate. I asked her to produce a league table of Departments to enable us to assess risks from the bug Department by Department. Eventually, a sort of league table was agreed.

The Minister has 20 minutes to reply, so will he tell us how the Government will judge whether self-regulation does or does not work? What will the criteria be? Part I contains clauses 1 to 9, which make up 60 per cent. of the Bill. Whether part I comes into effect will depend on the answer to those questions.

that was one of the suggestions that we heard from the Opposition--

"The scheme should have a means of taking into account the views of consumers.

The scheme needs effective mechanisms for ensuring compliance with these standards"--

ion put, That the amendment be made:--

The House divided: Ayes 128, Noes 319.

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Peter AinsworthEast SurreyConaye
Michael AncramDevizesCon (front bench)aye
James ArbuthnotNorth East HampshireCon (front bench)aye
Peter AtkinsonHexhamConaye
Tony BaldryBanburyCon (front bench)aye
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Angela BrowningTiverton and HonitonCon (front bench)aye
John ButterfillBournemouth WestConaye
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Dr Michael ClarkRayleighConaye
Geoffrey Clifton-BrownCotswoldCon (front bench)tellaye
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Mr James CranBeverley and HoldernessConaye
Quentin DaviesGrantham and StamfordConaye
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Alan DuncanRutland and MeltonCon (front bench)aye
Iain Duncan SmithChingford and Woodford GreenCon (front bench)aye
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Michael FabricantLichfieldCon (front bench)aye
Michael FallonSevenoaksCon (front bench)aye
Mr Howard FlightArundel and South DownsConaye
Eric ForthBromley and ChislehurstConaye
Mr Norman FowlerSutton ColdfieldConaye
Liam FoxWoodspringCon (front bench)aye
Christopher FraserMid Dorset and North PooleConaye
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Nick GibbBognor Regis and LittlehamptonCon (front bench)aye
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Philip HammondRunnymede and WeybridgeCon (front bench)aye
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Oliver HealdNorth East HertfordshireCon (front bench)tellaye
David Heathcoat-AmoryWellsConaye
John HoramOrpingtonConaye
Michael HowardFolkestone and HytheConaye
Mr Andrew HunterBasingstokeConaye
Michael JackFyldeConaye
Robert JacksonWantageConaye
Bernard JenkinNorth EssexCon (front bench)aye
Robert KeySalisburyConaye
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Julie KirkbrideBromsgroveConaye
Eleanor LaingEpping ForestCon (front bench)aye
Jacqui LaitBeckenhamConaye
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Edward LeighGainsboroughCon (front bench)aye
Oliver LetwinWest DorsetCon (front bench)aye
Julian LewisNew Forest EastCon (front bench)aye
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Sir Peter LloydFarehamConaye
Tim LoughtonEast Worthing and ShorehamCon (front bench)aye
Peter LuffMid WorcestershireCon (front bench)aye
Sir Nicholas LyellNorth East BedfordshireConaye
Andrew MacKayBracknellConaye
David MacleanPenrith and The BorderConaye
Mr David MadelSouth West BedfordshireConaye
Humfrey MalinsWokingConaye
John MaplesStratford-on-AvonCon (front bench)aye
Michael MatesEast HampshireConaye
Francis MaudeHorshamCon (front bench)aye
Dr Brian MawhinneyNorth West CambridgeshireConaye
Theresa MayMaidenheadCon (front bench)aye
Anne McIntoshVale of YorkCon (front bench)aye
Patrick McLoughlinWest DerbyshireCon (front bench)aye
Malcolm MossNorth East CambridgeshireConaye
Mr Patrick NichollsTeignbridgeConaye
Stephen O'BrienEddisburyCon (front bench)aye
Richard OttawayCroydon SouthCon (front bench)aye
Mr Richard PageSouth West HertfordshireConaye
James PaiceSouth East CambridgeshireCon (front bench)aye
Owen PatersonNorth ShropshireCon (front bench)aye
Eric PicklesBrentwood and OngarCon (front bench)aye
Mr David PriorNorth NorfolkCon (front bench)aye
John RedwoodWokinghamCon (front bench)aye
Andrew RobathanBlabyCon (front bench)aye
Laurence RobertsonTewkesburyCon (front bench)aye
Mrs Marion RoeBroxbourneConaye
Mr Andrew RoweFaversham and Mid KentConaye
David RuffleyBury St EdmundsCon (front bench)aye
Mr Jonathan SayeedMid BedfordshireConaye
Mrs Gillian ShephardSouth West NorfolkConaye
Richard ShepherdAldridge-BrownhillsCon (front bench)aye
Keith SimpsonMid NorfolkCon (front bench)aye
Caroline SpelmanMeridenCon (front bench)aye
Michael SpicerWest WorcestershireCon (front bench)aye
Richard SpringWest SuffolkConaye
Mr Nick St AubynGuildfordConaye
John StanleyTonbridge and MallingCon (front bench)aye
Anthony SteenTotnesConaye
Gary StreeterSouth West DevonCon (front bench)aye
Desmond SwayneNew Forest WestCon (front bench)aye
Peter TapsellLouth and HorncastleConaye
Ian TaylorEsher and WaltonConaye
Mr John TaylorSolihullConaye
Mr Teddy TaylorRochford and Southend EastConaye
David TredinnickBosworthCon (front bench)aye
Andrew TyrieChichesterCon (front bench)aye
Peter ViggersGosportConaye
Robert WalterNorth DorsetCon (front bench)aye
Charles WardleBexhill and Battlewhilst Conaye
Nigel WatersonEastbourneConaye
Mr Bowen WellsHertford and StortfordConaye
Sir Ray WhitneyWycombeConaye
John WhittingdaleMaldon and East ChelmsfordConaye
Mr John WilkinsonRuislip - NorthwoodConaye
Ann WintertonCongletonConaye
Nicholas WintertonMacclesfieldConaye
Shaun WoodwardWitneywhilst Conaye
Tim YeoSouth SuffolkCon (front bench)aye
Diane AbbottHackney North and Stoke NewingtonLab (minister)no
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Charlotte AtkinsStaffordshire MoorlandsLabno
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John CummingsEasingtonLabno
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Janet DeanBurtonLabno
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Andrew DismoreHendonLabno
Brian H DonohoeCunninghame SouthLab (minister)no
Frank DoranAberdeen CentralLabno
Jim DowdLewisham WestLab (minister)no
David DrewStroudLab (minister)no
Gwyneth DunwoodyCrewe and NantwichLabno
Angela EagleWallaseyLab (minister)no
Maria EagleLiverpool, GarstonLabno
Mr Huw EdwardsMonmouthLabno
Clive EffordElthamLab (minister)no
Louise EllmanLiverpool, RiversideLabno
Jeff EnnisBarnsley East and MexboroughLabno
Frank FieldBirkenheadLabno
Mark FisherStoke-on-Trent CentralLabno
Jim FitzpatrickPoplar and Canning TownLabno
Ms Lorna FitzsimonsRochdaleLabno
Caroline FlintDon ValleyLab (minister)no
Barbara FollettStevenageLabno
Mr Derek FosterBishop AucklandLab (minister)no
Michael FosterWorcesterLabno
Michael Jabez FosterHastings and RyeLabno
George GallowayGlasgow KelvinLabno
Mike GapesIlford SouthLab (minister)no
Barry GardinerBrent NorthLab (minister)no
Neil GerrardWalthamstowLabno
Ian GibsonNorwich NorthLabno
Linda GilroyPlymouth, SuttonLabno
Roger GodsiffBirmingham, Sparkbrook and Small HeathLabno
Paul GogginsWythenshawe and Sale EastLabno
Mrs Llin GoldingNewcastle-under-LymeLabno
Mrs Eileen GordonRomfordLabno
Ms Jane GriffithsReading EastLabno
Mr Win GriffithsBridgendLabno
Mr Bruce GrocottTelfordLabno
John GroganSelbyLab (minister)no
Peter HainNeathLab (minister)no
Mike HallWeaver ValeLab (minister)no
Patrick HallBedfordLabno
Fabian HamiltonLeeds North EastLab (minister)no
David HansonDelynLab (minister)no
Harriet HarmanCamberwell and PeckhamLab (minister)no
Sylvia HealHalesowen and Rowley Regiswhilst Labno
John HealeyWentworthLabno
Doug HendersonNewcastle upon Tyne NorthLabno
Mr Ivan HendersonHarwichLabno
Stephen HepburnJarrowLab (minister)no
John HeppellNottingham EastLabno
Stephen HesfordWirral WestLabno
Patricia HewittLeicester WestLab (minister)no
Keith HillStreathamLab (minister)no
Margaret HodgeBarkingLab (minister)no
Phil HopeCorbyLabno
Kelvin HopkinsLuton NorthLabno
Mr Alan HowarthNewport EastLab (minister)no
George HowarthKnowsley North and Sefton EastLab (minister)no
Kim HowellsPontypriddLab (minister)no
Lindsay HoyleChorleyLab (minister)no
Beverley HughesStretford and UrmstonLab (minister)no
Mr Kevin HughesDoncaster NorthLab (minister)tellno
Joan HumbleBlackpool North and FleetwoodLabno
Mr Alan HurstBraintreeLabno
John HuttonBarrow and FurnessLab (minister)no
Brian IddonBolton South EastLabno
Eric IllsleyBarnsley CentralLabno
Mrs Helen JacksonSheffield, HillsboroughLabno
Mr David JamiesonPlymouth, DevonportLab (minister)tellno
Brian JenkinsTamworthLabno
Alan JohnsonKingston upon Hull West and HessleLab (minister)no
Miss Melanie JohnsonWelwyn HatfieldLab (minister)no
Mr Barry JonesAlyn and DeesideLabno
Helen JonesWarrington NorthLab (minister)no
Mr Jon Owen JonesCardiff CentralLabno
Martyn JonesClwyd SouthLabno
Gerald KaufmanManchester, GortonLab (minister)no
Sally KeebleNorthampton NorthLabno
Alan KeenFeltham and HestonLabno
Ruth KellyBolton WestLabno
Fraser KempHoughton and Washington EastLabno
Jane KennedyLiverpool, WavertreeLab (minister)no
Piara S KhabraEaling, SouthallLabno
David KidneyStaffordLabno
Peter KilfoyleLiverpool, WaltonLab (minister)no
Mr Andy KingRugby and KenilworthLabno
Ms Oona KingBethnal Green and BowLab (minister)no
Ashok KumarMiddlesbrough South and East ClevelandLabno
Stephen LadymanSouth ThanetLabno
Mrs Jackie LawrencePreseli PembrokeshireLabno
David LepperBrighton, PavilionLabno
Chris LeslieShipleyLabno
Tom LevittHigh PeakLabno
Ivan LewisBury SouthLab (minister)no
Mr Terry LewisWorsleyLabno
Mrs Helen LiddellAirdrie and ShottsLab (minister)no
Martin LintonBatterseaLabno
Ken LivingstoneBrent Eastwhilst Labno
Tony LloydManchester CentralLabno
Andrew LoveEdmontonLab (minister)no
Mr Calum MacDonaldNa h-Eileanan an IarLabno
Andrew MacKinlayThurrockLabno
Mrs Alice MahonHalifaxLabno
Judy MallaberAmber ValleyLabno
Gordon MarsdenBlackpool SouthLab (minister)no
Mr Paul MarsdenShrewsbury and AtchamLabno
David MarshallGlasgow ShettlestonLabno
Robert Marshall-AndrewsMedwayLabno
Eric MartlewCarlisleLabno
Thomas McAvoyGlasgow RutherglenLab (minister)no
Ian McCartneyMakerfieldLab (minister)no
John Martin McDonnellHayes and HarlingtonLabno
Rosemary McKennaCumbernauld and KilsythLabno
Tony McNultyHarrow EastLab (minister)no
Mr John McWilliamBlaydonLabno
Alan MealeMansfieldLab (minister)no
Gillian MerronLincolnLabno
Mr Bill MichieSheffield, HeeleyLabno
Alan MilburnDarlingtonLab (minister)no
Andrew MillerEllesmere Port and NestonLabno
Austin MitchellGreat GrimsbyLab (minister)no
Dr Lewis MoonieKirkcaldyLab (minister)no
Julie MorganCardiff NorthLabno
Elliot MorleyScunthorpeLab (minister)no
Ms Estelle MorrisBirmingham, YardleyLab (minister)no
Kali MountfordColne ValleyLabno
Chris MullinSunderland SouthLab (minister)no
Denis MurphyWansbeckLabno
Jim MurphyEast RenfrewshireLab (minister)no
Paul MurphyTorfaenLab (minister)no
Doug NaysmithBristol North WestLabno
Mr Bill O'BrienNormantonLabno
Mike O'BrienNorth WarwickshireLab (minister)no
Bill OlnerNuneatonLabno
Mrs Diana OrganForest of DeanLabno
Sandra OsborneAyrLabno
Nick PalmerBroxtoweLabno
Ian PearsonDudley SouthLabno
Mr Tom PendryStalybridge and HydeLabno
Mr Colin PickthallWest LancashireLabno
Mr Peter PikeBurnleyLabno
James PlaskittWarwick and LeamingtonLabno
Mr Kerry PollardSt AlbansLabno
Mr Chris PondGraveshamLabno
Greg PopeHyndburnLab (minister)no
Mr Raymond PowellOgmoreLabno
Bridget PrenticeLewisham EastLabno
Gordon PrenticePendleLabno
Ken PurchaseWolverhampton North EastLabno
Ms Joyce QuinGateshead East and Washington WestLab (minister)no
Mr Lawrie QuinnScarborough and WhitbyLabno
Mr Giles RadiceNorth DurhamLab (minister)no
Bill RammellHarlowLabno
Andy ReedLoughboroughLabno
Mrs Barbara RocheHornsey and Wood GreenLab (minister)no
Mr Allan RogersRhonddaLabno
Mr Jeff RookerBirmingham, Perry BarrLab (minister)no
Terry RooneyBradford NorthLabno
Mr Ernie RossDundee WestLabno
Mr Ted RowlandsMerthyr Tydfil and RhymneyLab (minister)no
Frank RoyMotherwell and WishawLabno
Chris RuaneVale of ClwydLab (minister)no
Joan RuddockLewisham, DeptfordLabno
Martin SalterReading WestLabno
Mohammad SarwarGlasgow GovanLabno
Mr Malcolm SavidgeAberdeen NorthLabno
Mr Phil SawfordKetteringLabno
Mr Brian SedgemoreHackney South and ShoreditchLabno
Jonathan R ShawChatham and AylesfordLabno
Barry SheermanHuddersfieldLabno
Mr Robert SheldonAshton-under-LyneLab (minister)no
Alan SimpsonNottingham SouthLabno
Marsha SinghBradford WestLabno
Andrew SmithOxford EastLab (minister)no
Angela SmithBasildonLabno
Jacqui SmithRedditchLab (minister)no
John SmithVale of GlamorganLabno
Mr Llew SmithBlaenau GwentLabno
Mr Peter SnapeWest Bromwich EastLabno
Mr Clive SoleyEaling, Acton and Shepherd's BushLab (minister)no
John SpellarWarleyLab (minister)no
Rachel SquireDunfermline WestLabno
Phyllis StarkeyMilton Keynes South WestLabno
Mr Gerry SteinbergCity of DurhamLabno
Mr George StevensonStoke-on-Trent SouthLabno
Mr David StewartInverness East, Nairn and LochaberLabno
Ian StewartEcclesLabno
Mr Paul StinchcombeWellingboroughLabno
Gavin StrangEdinburgh East and MusselburghLabno
Jack StrawBlackburnLab (minister)no
Graham StringerManchester, BlackleyLab (minister)no
Gisela StuartBirmingham, EdgbastonLab (minister)no
Gerry SutcliffeBradford SouthLab (minister)no
Mrs Ann TaylorDewsburyLab (minister)no
Dari TaylorStockton SouthLabno
Mr Peter Temple-MorrisLeominsterwhilst Labno
Stephen TimmsEast HamLab (minister)no
Paddy TippingSherwoodLab (minister)no
Mark ToddSouth DerbyshireLabno
Don TouhigIslwynLab (minister)no
Jon TrickettHemsworthLabno
Paul TruswellPudseyLabno
Mr Dennis TurnerWolverhampton South EastLab (minister)no
Desmond TurnerBrighton, KemptownLabno
Dr George TurnerNorth West NorfolkLabno
Neil TurnerWiganLabno
Derek TwiggHaltonLabno
Stephen TwiggEnfield, SouthgateLabno
Mr Bill TynanHamilton SouthLabno
Joan WalleyStoke-on-Trent NorthLab (minister)no
Claire WardWatfordLabno
Robert WareingLiverpool, West DerbyLabno
Dave WattsSt Helens NorthLab (minister)no
Mr Brian WhiteNorth East Milton KeynesLabno
Alan WhiteheadSouthampton, TestLab (minister)no
Malcolm WicksCroydon NorthLab (minister)no
Dr Alan WilliamsCarmarthen East and DinefwrLabno
Betty WilliamsConwyLabno
Michael WillsNorth SwindonLab (minister)no
David WinnickWalsall NorthLab (minister)no
Rosie WintertonDoncaster CentralLabno
Mike WoodBatley and SpenLabno
Phil WoolasOldham East and SaddleworthLabno
Mr Tony WorthingtonClydebank and MilngavieLabno
Anthony D WrightGreat YarmouthLabno
Tony WrightCannock ChaseLabno
Derek WyattSittingbourne and SheppeyLabno
Mr Richard AllanSheffield, HallamLDem (front bench)no
Norman BakerLewesLDem (front bench)no
Mrs Jackie BallardTauntonLDemno
Vincent CableTwickenhamLDem (front bench)no
Mr David ChidgeyEastleighLDem (front bench)no
Mr Ronnie FearnSouthportLDemno
Nick HarveyNorth DevonLDem (front bench)no
David HeathSomerton and FromeLDem (front bench)no
Simon HughesNorth Southwark and BermondseyLDem (front bench)no
Mr Archy KirkwoodRoxburgh and BerwickshireLDem (front bench)no
Mr David RendelNewburyLDemno
Bob RussellColchesterLDem (front bench)no
Adrian SandersTorbayLDem (front bench)no
Robert SmithWest Aberdeenshire and KincardineLDem (front bench)no
Andrew StunellHazel GroveLDem (front bench)no
Steve WebbNorthavonLDem (front bench)no
Phil WillisHarrogate and KnaresboroughLDem (front bench)no
Elfyn LlwydMeirionnydd Nant ConwyPC (front bench)aye
Alex SalmondBanff and BuchanSNP (front bench)no
Andrew WelshAngusSNPno

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